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-psycledelics- » Discussions » OFF TOPIC » Piano Roll
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GoaTrance




Date Registered:
02.2004
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Piano Roll        Go on top to this Page

Implement a piano roll and support for Buzz machines and ill use it for sure.

27.02.2004, 20:33 Profile of GoaTrance Add GoaTrance to your Buddy-List
FingerSoup




Date Registered:
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Oskari (the coder for Buzz) has denied us the ability to use Buzz machines directly. There is, however, BuzzVST, over on http://www.jeskola.net which will allow you to use Buzz machines in Psycle through a VST Wrapper.

So if you get BuzzVST, you'll be half way there.

Piano roll has been suggested a million times before... I'm not sure where the dev team stands on this, but as Psycle is a tracker, I don't think this is a necessary tool. I'm sure it would be nice for all those people who are used to using one though


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I thought you beat the inevitability of death to death, just a little bit...

Last edited by FingerSoup on 27.02.2004, 21:40 o'clock.

27.02.2004, 21:39 Profile of FingerSoup Add FingerSoup to your Buddy-List
GoaTrance




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altough there are some trackers that are implementing Piano roll , like AeroStudio , but Aero is not so developed
and it´s still limited.
I like psychle but it´s also a tracker and dont features the powerfull Buzz machines that Buzz does.Anyway Psycle is very low cpu consumer and so as Buzz so ill just just Psycle if it implements a piano roll .

27.02.2004, 23:37 Profile of GoaTrance Add GoaTrance to your Buddy-List
Taika-Kim




Date Registered:
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You can always use VST, there's a lot of insanely great stuff coming out these days, and a lot of it is freeware.

BUT I think that alternate sequencers should be taken into consideration now, when the next BIG version update is planned and things can be still easily changed.

Lately I've been somewhat bothered by the low resolution of the tracker-style matrix, if I wanted to use, say a resolution of 64ths with note-offs, I would have to use TPB 32, which is really completely unpractical...

How about being able to eliminate the dividing horizontal lines in the pattern view and being able to then drag the notes around horizontally?
The lines could be handled just like snap grid maybe?

This would easily allow for great resolution, and would make recording stuff from keyboards, pads etc much more easy.
Percussion patterns could be made much more lively, etc...

Of course this can now be by hand by inserting note delay values, but this seems rather cumbersome... I've got to give it a try someday though.

In this proposition there is still the problem that we couldn't have very rapid successions of notes because this would lead to serious cluttering of the note names on screen.

Comments, anybody? Let's invent the ultimate trick to make tracker sequencers finally go beyond techno

28.02.2004, 14:11 Profile of Taika-Kim Add Taika-Kim to your Buddy-List Homepage of Taika-Kim
GoaTrance




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add a fuckin piano roll , period.

28.02.2004, 15:23 Profile of GoaTrance Add GoaTrance to your Buddy-List
FingerSoup




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quote:
Original by Taika-Kim

How about being able to eliminate the dividing horizontal lines in the pattern view and being able to then drag the notes around horizontally?
The lines could be handled just like snap grid maybe?

This would easily allow for great resolution, and would make recording stuff from keyboards, pads etc much more easy.
Percussion patterns could be made much more lively, etc...




This would essentially kick every song song into LPB=32, wouldn't it? In effect, wouldn't it be harder to pinpoint the timing you want?

I'm all for more natural sounding music, but at what cost?

What I've started experimenting with (for guitar strums anyways) is inputing the basic structure at LPB=4, and then, once the song is finished in structure, Jack the LPB up to 32, use the "adapt content to new size" feature when changing my pattern length, and jack my pattern lengths up to fix the speed issues. From there, it's just tweaking placement so that the D string gets "hit" before the G string, etc...

Therefore, a lower LPB and pattern length is effect, is your snap-to effect, only it's a little more manually processed. Now if there were a way to AUTOMATICALLY do all that I have mentioned, (expand the entire song based on Lines per Beat), I think you'd be able to get your accuracy, without as much hassle, and still keep the traditional tracker interface.


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I thought you beat the inevitability of death to death, just a little bit...

28.02.2004, 20:32 Profile of FingerSoup Add FingerSoup to your Buddy-List
nolwenn




Date Registered:
05.2003
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France
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quote:
By fingersoup : Piano roll has been suggested a million times before... I'm not sure where the dev team stands on this, but as Psycle is a tracker, I don't think this is a necessary tool


For me Psycle is more than a tracker
ft2 is a tracker, protracker and oktalyzer too. Psycle is nettement meilleur y pas photo.

Psycle needs just one thing to be the real secret weapon : a piano roll.

But i agree with you fingersoup to keep the tracker representation : this way to make music is very efficient.
The piano roll would be la cerise sur le gateau, the extra addition that make Psycle the best tool.

I dream to continue tracking with psycle, and then, open this famous piano roll, play with my clavier maitre and put this in the project in the 'multipattern view" this multi pattern view would be in horizontally oriented of course.

There would be many view (machine, pattern, piano roll, multi pattern) but it would satisfy everone. i think.

quant au buzz machine c'est clair qu'on peut s'en passer avec tout les VST de qualité et gratos qui existent

bonus question au passage : Will the support for native machine be continued ? or they will be recoded in VST format ?

28.02.2004, 21:01 Profile of nolwenn Add nolwenn to your Buddy-List
GoaTrance




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i prefer the Native format.
The more grafic minimalistic psycle features , the best less cpu powerr will be given and psycle will kick ass.

Last edited by GoaTrance on 28.02.2004, 22:42 o'clock.

28.02.2004, 22:39 Profile of GoaTrance Add GoaTrance to your Buddy-List
BJohan




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nice frenglish nolwenn :p

28.02.2004, 22:45 Profile of BJohan Add BJohan to your Buddy-List Homepage of BJohan Add BJohan to your Contact-List AIM Screenname: bohan@jabber.org (no A0L) YIM Screenname: bohan@jabber.org (no Yah00!1)
BJohan




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quote:
Original by GoaTrance
i prefer the Native format.
The more grafic minimalistic psycle features , the best less cpu powerr will be given and psycle will kick ass. 8)



i wonder what's the current license status regarding an implementation of the vst spec on unix... if it's still forbidden, i prefer anything else than vst.

about minimalistic graphics, i totally agree with you! many plugins are wasting too many cpu cycles rendering 3d-raytraced knobs or whatever useless eye candy ;p

Last edited by BJohan on 28.02.2004, 22:51 o'clock.

28.02.2004, 22:48 Profile of BJohan Add BJohan to your Buddy-List Homepage of BJohan Add BJohan to your Contact-List AIM Screenname: bohan@jabber.org (no A0L) YIM Screenname: bohan@jabber.org (no Yah00!1)
GoaTrance




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that´s why i prefer Buzz.
Only thing that i dont like in Buzz is that dont features a piano roll

29.02.2004, 10:30 Profile of GoaTrance Add GoaTrance to your Buddy-List
sampler




Date Registered:
11.2001
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Leganes, Spain
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I don't like piano roll at all, mainly because i've still not seen anyone where u can enter notes with PC keyb. Maybe if i could enter notes with PC keyb or if i'd have a MIDI keyb i'd use it.
It's true that the classic tracker interface (at least Psycle one) could be (and should be) improved a bit....

But another question. If the multipattern seq was coded in a right way i think it could be changed between a horizontal and a vertical view... but maybe it's too late at this point.


__________________
Am i going to be the same next year???? Will i use Psycle next years?? :rolleyes:

29.02.2004, 21:40 Profile of sampler Add sampler to your Buddy-List Add sampler to your Contact-List AIM Screenname: jegln6 YIM Screenname: jegln6
GoaTrance




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in Fruity loops you can insert notes with pc keyboard

01.03.2004, 10:41 Profile of GoaTrance Add GoaTrance to your Buddy-List
Taika-Kim




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Ditto, Bjohan, along with gaelic maybe, written French is one of the most beautiful imaginable languages.
Hmm and Quenya of course

Nice idea, that expanding trick, I'll have to try it sometime.

What I meant by removing the grid was that this way moving the note up, say, 4 pixels would be the equivalent of, say 64th note.
This way the big resolutions wouldn't need big screen resolution.

And automatically inserting note delays for greater accuracy when recording through MIDI would be useful for keyboard players, maybe?

Or how about some per-track naturalizer? (some kind of groove effect in practice?)

01.03.2004, 12:35 Profile of Taika-Kim Add Taika-Kim to your Buddy-List Homepage of Taika-Kim
DMNXS




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I thought about that automatic song expansion when changing the resolution (LPB) myself . That'd be great.

01.03.2004, 13:57 Profile of DMNXS Add DMNXS to your Buddy-List Add DMNXS to your Contact-List
nolwenn




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DMNXS the automatic song expansion when changing LPB could be very nice ! and easy to code i think...

I always forget to check the "adapt content to new size" box ça me rend folle !

Taika kim nous a dit :

quote:
And automatically inserting note delays for greater accuracy when recording through MIDI would be useful for keyboard players, maybe?


I am getting mad actually because i can't record note velocity (while playing live with my MIDI keyboard) and note delay (by inserting it manually) at the same time.

So the feature you describe would need a larger pattern to insert 0cXX and FDxx at the same time i think

Piano roll appears to be the better solution for those who have a MIDI keyboard and want to play live...

Native plugins are great, but changing ffff in ff and vice versa in the midi controller dialog (when tweaking with a external controller) is incredibly annoying

Taika kim you are right french langage is magnifique. C'est la langue de l'amour.
Psycle, c'est plus d'amour et plus de vybe

01.03.2004, 23:12 Profile of nolwenn Add nolwenn to your Buddy-List
DMNXS




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quote:
Original by nolwenn
DMNXS the automatic song expansion when changing LPB could be very nice ! and easy to code i think...


Yeah, too bad I can't program myself .

02.03.2004, 11:02 Profile of DMNXS Add DMNXS to your Buddy-List Add DMNXS to your Contact-List
GoaTrance




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helloooooooooooooooooooooO?
is someone can read? this topic´s about piano roll!

02.03.2004, 15:03 Profile of GoaTrance Add GoaTrance to your Buddy-List
FingerSoup




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And we're talking about a piano roll inderectly as well. . What are the ways we can get around without a piano roll, for the time being...

As I said... The piano roll has been suggested many times before... Check the Main board and the Tech board especially...

And I'm not against a piano roll.... It just doesn't seem likely in the near future, and it's a redundant interface... Although, nobody said redundancy was a bad thing...


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03.03.2004, 00:11 Profile of FingerSoup Add FingerSoup to your Buddy-List
GoaTrance




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you´re acting such a FOOLS.
Jeskola Buzz is 10000000000000000000000000000 X better than this Psycle tracker , anyway BUZZle is beeing programmed and is gonna implemtent a piano roll aswelll , so forget psycle cause it looks like a kid´s toy.
Buzz rules , it´s more intuitive , you have TONS of machines and it´s more completed than Psycle.

Psycle´s DEAD.

03.03.2004, 15:41 Profile of GoaTrance Add GoaTrance to your Buddy-List
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